Nazarene Space

Friday evening to Sunday morning is not three days

Every year at Pesach this discussion comes up: "when was Y'shua` really executed, and when did He rise?" There is always the conflict about which days were Shabos, when firstfruits was, and when the counting of the `omer should begin. The glaring issue to be resolved is the fact that the traditional friday to sunday timeline doesn't work out with the B'ris Chadashah. 
The best I can come up with is that He was executed on the fifteenth of Nisan, was burried just before sunset, making the sixteenth, seventeenth, and eighteenth the three days for the "sign of Yonah" - and rose on the nineteenth just after sunset (with the nineteenth being a sunday, because it says the women went to the tomb directly after Shabos ended).
This still leaves one issue: it says He was taken down from the stake quickly because of Shabos. What is the Shabos that is being spoken of?

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YHWH is not the author of confusion (1 Cor 14:33).  You are correct that erev is the point that divides two days, but

to be clear why not also say that that particular "zero dimensional point (???)" is also the moment that the sun disappears behind the western horizon?  Gen 1:5 establishes that according to according to YHWH's calendar 'erev' precedes 'boker'.  Therefore your assertion that the erev of the 14th starts the 15th is incorrect.

The Rabbinic definition as expounded by Rashi is nonsensical:  the first 'erev' starts a minute after noon (12:00 pm) and the second 'erev' is the beginning of the night.  If this is the case why do we never find in Scriptures any reference to a 'first erev' or 'second erev' ? Why? Because it is not an original term.

So, Mr Trimm, you are saying that 'erev' of the 14th begins the 15th;  Then what is your definition of the phrase between the two evenings (bein ha arbayim)??

An analysis of  Matthew 26:17 shows that the writer, Matthew, the Disciple of Yeshua who walked around with the Maschiach, considers the 14th the First day of Unleavened Bread.  Isn't this an indication that he, knowing full well the opinion of the Word/Logos/Memra supports the 14th as the 1st day, although the Festival day of that name is actually celebrated on the 15th.  A bit confusing, but Yeshua's practice on the matter sheds determinative light.

Onieu bahn Duid said:

Why does Exodus say the first day of unleavened bread begins the evening of the 14th, whereas Leviticus says the first day of unleavened bread begins on the 15th?

You are right I can't prove it was a lamb, but it must have been either a lamb or a goat (see Exodus 12:4&5).  But the word Pesach clearly means the sacrificial animal, so it was one of the two.  I don't think it makes much difference. Some sort of sacrificial animal was eaten.

Proof of this is found at .   Mark 14:12 Now on the first day of Unleavened Bread, when they killed the Passover [lamb], His disciples said to Him, "Where do You want us to go and prepare, that You may eat the Passover?"

Here 'Passover' cannot refer generically to the time period.



Solomon Avar said:

"These scriptures specifically mention eating the lamb."

Where is the word lamb mentioned ?
You say it is specifically mentioned that they ate lamb, so where is it mentioned ?

"it is very possible that the place in which YHWH's name was placed regarding Passover observance could have changed as well."

I don't think you can prove that, and it seems your theory depends on that unproven assertion.

There is no proof they slew or ate lamb at the last supper, or that the last supper was passover;
if I book a hotel room "for Christmas" that doesn't mean I'm checking in on Christmas day; likely I have ordered it and checked in some time in advance.
That's the impression I get from Lk.22:11

Jeremiah Dalton said:

I see your point, but I would point to the following scriptures:

  Luke 22:8  And He sent Peter and John, saying, "Go and prepare the Passover for us, that we may eat."

 Luke 22:11  "Then you shall say to the master of the house, 'The Teacher says to you, "Where is the guest room where I may eat the Passover with My disciples?" '

These scriptures specifically mention eating the lamb.

If the Yeshua at baptism, as I believe, by John became High Priest and the High Priesthood changed, it is very possible that the place in which YHWH's name was placed regarding Passover observance could have changed as well.

Enoch's calendar is becoming even more clear to me now. By deductive reasoning and by other witnesses that I've discussed this matter with. Another piece of exciting news that I found out regarding Enoch's calendar is that it is broken up into a 360 degree circle. The four extra days in Enoch's calendar represent the days when the Sun stays in the same decan/degree at least one extra day. These extra days occur at the solstices and equinoxes. The new moon occaisionally falls on these dates but the majority of the time doesn't. Enoch says that the moon follows it's own peculiar pattern. The possibility exists that the moon at some time in the past may have fell accurately and consistently on these days. However at our present day and age we know without question that it does not.

Grammar problems arise with substituting New Moon in place of Month
Qumran Fragment 4QcommGen A Column II Verse 1
Reading right to left:
יום עשר ובשבעה נוח לחיי שנה מאות ושש באחת
day ten in the seven Noah life year hundredth sixth In the
השני לחודש
two month
The above is translated as “In the 600th year of Noah's life in the seventeen day of the second month.”
Note:
a) per hebrew dictionary Chodesh חֹדֶשׁ is month not new moon
b) per hebrew dictionary Chid-desh חִדֵּשׁ is to renew
c) per hebrew dictionary Cha-dash חָדָשׁ is new or unused
d) per hebrew dictionary Chid-dooshחִדּוּשׁ is a new moon or new idea
e) per hebrew dictionary Chood-deshחֻדַּשׁ renew or to recommense
f) per hebrew dictionary Cha-deshai חָדְשִׁי monthly (adjective)
g) Meed-dai Chodesh Bay-Chad-Shoמִדֵּי חֹדֶשׁ בְּחָדְשׁוֹ each and every month
h) per hebrew dictionary Ha-Chodesh הַחֹ֧דֶשׁ the month
i) per hebrew dictionary Yarecha יָרֵחַ moon
j) per hebrew dictionary Yarechon יַרְחוֹן monthly (noun)
k) Genesis 7:11a בַּחֹ֙דֶשׁ This word usually appears with another qualifier word to help determine which month of the year is applicable such as: first month, second month, etc.
l) Genesis 7:11b לַחֹ֑דֶשׁ This word-usually appears with another qualifier word to help determine which day of the month is applicable such as: first day, second day, etc.
In Genesis 8:13 the Hebrew word: לַחֹ֔דֶשׁ appears. However if it qualifies as a word to represent the “New Moon” without any additional grammar help? Then why does a redundant qualifier word such as:אֶחָ֣ד (meaning: first) preceed it. Other redundant qualifiers are found in Ex 40:2, Ex 40:17,
Lev 23:24, Num 1:1, Num 1:18,
Referring to line g above if Chodesh were used for each and every new moon instead of each and every month then you would be limiting yourself to one day for each new moon instead of a full 30(+) days for each new month
 
For proper Hebrew grammar the New Things” shown below require at least two Hebrew words for proper Hebrew grammar and tranliteration:
New Day, New Year, New Age, New Covenant, New King. New Offering, New House, New gods,
New Rope, New Cart, New Sword, New Cloak, and many others.
With this in mind; Why would the New Moon be the only exception to this rule by requiring only one word Chodesh to represent its full intended meaning?
Which transliteration of Genesis 29:14b is correct?
1 Surely thou art my bone and my flesh and he abode with him a space of a new moon (1 day)
2 Surely thou art my bone and my flesh and he abode with him a space of a month (30 or 31 days)
This same problem occurs in Ex 19:1, Ex 23:15, Ex 34:18, Num 3:15, Num 3:22, Num 3:28,
Num 3:34, Num 3:39, Num 3:40, Num 3:43, Num 9:22, Num 11:20, Num 11:21, Num 18:16,
Num 26:62, Num 28:14.
Other witnesses to the problem of mistranslating month as new moon are shown below:
Notes:
First Witness: A new moon will not divide evenly into a 364 day year, however 3 solar months of 91 days will divide evenly into a 364 day year.
Second Witness: The greater light to rule the day is the Sun, the lesser light to rule the night is the stars.
Analogy: If your boss put you in charge of hiring two security guards to watch over his business. The first one was hired to work the day time shift from 6am to 6pm and the other security guard was hired to work the night time shift from 6pm to 6am how happy would your boss be if he came to find out that the night shift security guard left his night shift post to work along side the day time security guard. In actuality the Moon doesn't rule the night because it wasn't assigned to rule the night because it would be unfaithful in its rulership over the night. The stars always appear at night and the moon doesn't. The book of Jubilees sternly warns against using the moon as a time piece.
Third Witness: The Septuagint says the Greater light begins the day, The lesser light begins the night. The only faithful light that begins the night is the stars.
Fourth Witness: Both Chronicles and Qumran documents show 24 priestly rotations throughout the span of a 12 month cycle with with no exceptions representing a 13 month cycle.
FifthWitness: In all the Torah, Tanach, and Brit Hadesha no 13th month of Adar Bet is ever mentioned.
 
Let's study the verse listed below:
David said to Jonathan, tomorrow is the new moon, and I am to sit with the king at the meal.
Now let's reconstruct the verse on how it should should be literally translated...
hnh ntnwhy-la dwd rmayw
(upon us is) (Jonathan) (unto) (David) (Said)
bca bcy yknaw rjm cdh
(down) (to sit) (and I'm) (tomorrow) (the month)
lwkal klmh mu
(to eat) (the king) (with)

Friday Evening and Sunday morning are THREE DIFFERENT DAYS by all means they are three days.

Friday afternoon (is evening, when sun goes down). it is counted friday.

night to sundown of Shabbat is another day. it is counted as another day --the second day.

morning of yom rishon is another day (it cannot be counted as Shabbat) it is another day --the third day.

...

3 days 3 nights begin when Yeshua gave up Himself to the forces of darkness, entering Jerusalem purposely to institute the pesach memorial and get captured immediately after. for it is NOT something that He could have not prevented if He did not allow to happen to Him --it was the giving up of Himself that counts to the eyes of G-d --not the silly human thinking that He was captured because He cannot or was not able to escape."

3 nights =night of Friday (after thursday sundown) + night of Shabbat + night of sunday (after shabbat sundown).

3 days =daylight of friday, of shabbat, and the early daylight of sunday.

simple.

yes simple if you think the Jewish way of reckoning night and day.

but if you reckon it the way romans do in their 24 hour thinking you will miss the entire thing.

the scriptures do not say 72 hours nor does it say 24 hours. tanakh has never been roman :)

shalom.

Shalom Beryl,

People get off track when they make the wrong assumption that the "heart of the earth" is an above ground tomb instead of realizing that the "heart of the earth" has always meant the city of Jerusalem.  Three times in the year Yahushua was commanded to go up to Jerusalem- Passover, Shavuot, and Sukkot.  Yahushua went up to Jerusalem for Passover when he died and rose again and he was there for 3 Days & 3 Nights from "Thursday" Erev 14 until "Sunday" Erev 17.

 

that's an interesting 'sod' John. if it means 'Jerusalem' then that explains the mystery.

thanks for that spark from you.

shalom.

 

John said:

Shalom Beryl,

People get off track when they make the wrong assumption that the "heart of the earth" is an above ground tomb instead of realizing that the "heart of the earth" has always meant the city of Jerusalem.  Three times in the year Yahushua was commanded to go up to Jerusalem- Passover, Shavuot, and Sukkot.  Yahushua went up to Jerusalem for Passover when he died and rose again and he was there for 3 Days & 3 Nights from "Thursday" Erev 14 until "Sunday" Erev 17.

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