Nazarene Space

I just wanted to get some opinions regarding a situation I have.

 

A christian lady that I know has her birthday coming up. Other christian friends are planning a little lunch party for her. They have invited me to play some worship songs during lunch (I play the guitar). However, this lunch party is going to be on a Sabbath. If I accept to play at this party, will that be considered a violation of the Sabbath? On the one hand, I'll only be playing worship songs, and for free, so maybe it wont be a violation since I'm not actually "working." But on the other hand, we are commanded to not do "our own pleasure" on the Sabbath.

 

What are your thoughts? Thanks.

 

Rudy Dominguez.

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Sounds like a great time to plant a few seeds in song and your own words to me! There's no violation in Sabbath keeping if that remains your motive IMO.

 

"abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day."

exodus 16:29



beryl etanah said:

 

"abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day."

exodus 16:29

 

 

contex:

25. And Moses said, Eat it today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field.   כה. וַיֹּאמֶר מֹשֶׁה אִכְלֻהוּ הַיּוֹם כִּי שַׁבָּת הַיּוֹם לַי־הֹוָ־ה הַיּוֹם לֹא תִמְצָאֻהוּ בַּשָּׂדֶה:
26. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day [which is the] Sabbath on it there will be none   כו. שֵׁשֶׁת יָמִים תִּלְקְטֻהוּ וּבַיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי שַׁבָּת לֹא יִהְיֶה בּוֹ:
27. It came about that on the seventh day, [some] of the people went out to gather [manna], but they did not find [any].   כז. וַיְהִי בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי יָצְאוּ מִן הָעָם לִלְקֹט וְלֹא מָצָאוּ:
28. The Lord said to Moses, How long will you refuse to observe My commandments and My teachings?   כח. וַיֹּאמֶר יְ־הֹוָ־ה אֶל מֹשֶׁה עַד אָנָה מֵאַנְתֶּם לִשְׁמֹר מִצְוֹתַי וְתוֹרֹתָי:
29. See that the Lord has given you the Sabbath. Therefore, on the sixth day, He gives you bread for two days. Let each man remain in his place; let no man leave his place on the seventh day   כט. רְאוּ כִּי יְ־הֹוָ־ה נָתַן לָכֶם הַשַּׁבָּת עַל כֵּן הוּא נֹתֵן לָכֶם בַּיּוֹם הַשִּׁשִּׁי לֶחֶם יוֹמָיִם שְׁבוּ אִישׁ תַּחְתָּיו אַל יֵצֵא אִישׁ מִמְּקֹמוֹ בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי:
30. So the people rested on the seventh day.   ל. וַיִּשְׁבְּתוּ הָעָם בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִעִי:

 

So go and play your music and enjoy your shabbat.

 

The word for "pleasure" is also "wishes" or "will".  It means that this is not a day to inflict our own will on the universe.

 

rachel, understand this:

before you enjoy, אם תשיב משבת רגלך עשות חפצך ביום קדשי וקראת לשבת ענג לקדוש יהוה מכבד וכבדתו מעשות דרכיך ממצוא חפצך ודבר דבר

 

Rachel Stern said:



beryl etanah said:

 

"abide ye every man in his place, let no man go out of his place on the seventh day."

exodus 16:29

 

 

contex:

25. And Moses said, Eat it today, for today is a Sabbath to the Lord; today you will not find it in the field.   כה. וַיֹּאמֶר מֹשֶׁה אִכְלֻהוּ הַיּוֹם כִּי שַׁבָּת הַיּוֹם לַי־הֹוָ־ה הַיּוֹם לֹא תִמְצָאֻהוּ בַּשָּׂדֶה:
26. Six days you shall gather it, but on the seventh day [which is the] Sabbath on it there will be none   כו. שֵׁשֶׁת יָמִים תִּלְקְטֻהוּ וּבַיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי שַׁבָּת לֹא יִהְיֶה בּוֹ:
27. It came about that on the seventh day, [some] of the people went out to gather [manna], but they did not find [any].   כז. וַיְהִי בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי יָצְאוּ מִן הָעָם לִלְקֹט וְלֹא מָצָאוּ:
28. The Lord said to Moses, How long will you refuse to observe My commandments and My teachings?   כח. וַיֹּאמֶר יְ־הֹוָ־ה אֶל מֹשֶׁה עַד אָנָה מֵאַנְתֶּם לִשְׁמֹר מִצְוֹתַי וְתוֹרֹתָי:
29. See that the Lord has given you the Sabbath. Therefore, on the sixth day, He gives you bread for two days. Let each man remain in his place; let no man leave his place on the seventh day   כט. רְאוּ כִּי יְ־הֹוָ־ה נָתַן לָכֶם הַשַּׁבָּת עַל כֵּן הוּא נֹתֵן לָכֶם בַּיּוֹם הַשִּׁשִּׁי לֶחֶם יוֹמָיִם שְׁבוּ אִישׁ תַּחְתָּיו אַל יֵצֵא אִישׁ מִמְּקֹמוֹ בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִיעִי:
30. So the people rested on the seventh day.   ל. וַיִּשְׁבְּתוּ הָעָם בַּיּוֹם הַשְּׁבִעִי:

 

So go and play your music and enjoy your shabbat.

 

Beryl,

understand this...

There's a difference between playing music for our own enjoyment and playing it as a tool in ministry and possibly experiencing "joy" while doing so. Again, there's no torah violation in what Rudy is contemplating so long as his motive is in reaching others. If you feel there is violation then please give your explanation of the multiple accounts we see in the writings of the Nazarenes of "leaving their dwelling" and subsequently Yeshua condoning the sins in your view. 



beryl etanah said:

 

rachel, understand this:

before you enjoy, אם תשיב משבת רגלך עשות חפצך ביום קדשי וקראת לשבת ענג לקדוש יהוה מכבד וכבדתו מעשות דרכיך ממצוא חפצך ודבר דבר

 



mikha El said:


. If you feel there is violation then please give your explanation of the multiple accounts we see in the writings of the Nazarenes of "leaving their dwelling"

Obviously it's fine to leave one''s dwelling. Jeremiah tells us not to carry burdens from our dwellings or out the city gates, therefore obviously they were leaving their dwellings and it was acceptable.

19. So said the Lord to me; Go and stand in the gate of the children of the people, in which the kings of Judah come, and out of which they go, and in all the gates of Jerusalem.
20. And you shall say to them: Hearken to the word of the Lord, O kings of Judah and all of Judah and all the inhabitants of Jerusalem, who come into these gates.
21. So said the Lord: Beware for your souls and carry no burden on the Sabbath day, nor bring into the gates of Jerusalem.
22. Neither shall you take a burden out of your houses on the Sabbath day nor shall you perform any labor, and you shall hallow the Sabbath day as I commanded your forefathers.



 


 

If you feel there is violation then please give your explanation of the multiple accounts we see in the writings of the Nazarenes of "leaving their dwelling" and subsequently Yeshua condoning the sins in your view.

 

what is violation to me may not be a violation to you and others. but since the OP solicited opinions i have submitted mine.

 

do you know what a "shabbat's walk" is? how far does it go from your dwelling? if not then you can fix your own: or none at all whatever you fashion your halacha.

 

good luck.

 



mikha El said:

Beryl,

understand this...

There's a difference between playing music for our own enjoyment and playing it as a tool in ministry and possibly experiencing "joy" while doing so. Again, there's no torah violation in what Rudy is contemplating so long as his motive is in reaching others. If you feel there is violation then please give your explanation of the multiple accounts we see in the writings of the Nazarenes of "leaving their dwelling" and subsequently Yeshua condoning the sins in your view. 



beryl etanah said:

 

rachel, understand this:

before you enjoy, אם תשיב משבת רגלך עשות חפצך ביום קדשי וקראת לשבת ענג לקדוש יהוה מכבד וכבדתו מעשות דרכיך ממצוא חפצך ודבר דבר

 

Beryl,

Earlier you insinuated a torah observant soul should not leave their dwelling...period. Now you seemed to have changed your view to the fact that under certain circumstances it is acceptable. Glad to see you have switched your position. As for as the intricacies involved in determining how far a "sabbath's day's journey"  is and under what circumstances a person is actually walking in this modern day we live in,... I as you will leave that to the reader to determine. I know NJ's stance on this issue. Are you sure you do?

better luck...



beryl etanah said:

If you feel there is violation then please give your explanation of the multiple accounts we see in the writings of the Nazarenes of "leaving their dwelling" and subsequently Yeshua condoning the sins in your view.

 

what is violation to me may not be a violation to you and others. but since the OP solicited opinions i have submitted mine.

 

do you know what a "shabbat's walk" is? how far does it go from your dwelling? if not then you can fix your own: or none at all whatever you fashion your halacha.

 

good luck.

 



 

no man can change my view. don't ever think.

I know NJ's stance on this issue. Are you sure you do?

 

i am not an NJ like you think you are. i am an OJ. we have different halacha.

 

sorry.

 

no man can change my view. don't ever think.


Hmmm... is this a riddle ?  Are you insinuating a woman might alter your perceptions ??? ;p


beryl etanah said:

 

no man can change my view. don't ever think.

I know NJ's stance on this issue. Are you sure you do?

 

i am not an NJ like you think you are. i am an OJ. we have different halacha.

 

sorry.

 

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