Nazarene Space

I recently heard a teaching that after Y'shua` died, the "good" part of Sh'ol was done away with, and the souls of the righteous now go directly to Heaven. I'm not one hundred percent convinced of this, seeing that in Revelation, it states that all will be judged at the final judgement. Wouldn't going directly to heaven imply that judgement has already taken place?
The subject generally confuses me, as there seems to be biblical evidence for every theory out there, from this one to reincarnation. Any thoughts? Also: is there an "official" Nazarene doctrine on this subject?

Views: 443

Reply to This

Replies to This Discussion

This is what I had concluded. I thought the teaching sounded a bit "churchy".
I guess it is true that some Messianic Judaism is just christianity with a kippah.
Devan Smiralia said:

I guess it is true that some Messianic Judaism is just christianity with a kippah.

very much so ;-)
There are also alot of Messianic congregations that are mostly made up of ethnic Jews but to be very honest when comparing Messianic to Nazarene Judaism the thing is that Messianic Judaism is actually;
Rabbinical Judaism + Yeshua = Messianic Judaism

they take on alot of the points that Orthodox Judaism takes for instance they say that there is still a gap between Jews and non-Jews and that only the Jewish people have "the burden of Torah" and other people can live anyway they want and so on... too bad Avraham or Noah weren't Yisraeli but they already knew the difference between clean and unclean animals and Avraham circumcised not only his own descendants but also all of the "strangers" that travelled with him were circumcised and brought into the Covenant and let's not forget Adam's sons making offerings eventhough offerings to YHWH are a "Jewish/Torah only thing" and i could go on and on...

look man to see the difference in doctrine between Nazarene and Messianic Judaism please read the following link it's very well written and sums up the differences between the two;
http://yourarmstoisrael.com/Articles_new/restoration/12.php
I agree - however, Messianic Judaism seems to pick and choose which rabinic points they follow. It actually seems to be more like "Karaite Judaism + Rabinic Judaism + a still slightly christianized Y'shua` = Messianic Judaism"

The reason that it seems to take some orthodox points, is because it is very often trying to mix christianity with Judaism, rather than be a sect of Judaism which believes that Y'shua` is Moshiach.

I agree much more with Nazarene Judaism, because it is Judaism, rather than christianity trying to look Jewish.
I consider myself Orthodox, because I choose to follow the teachings of the Jewish sages, as Y'shua` would have, and as He said to in Matisyahu 23. There are a few Orthodox Messianic congregations out there, unfortunately, none of them are anywhere near where I live.
Anaiah Priel (Andrew P) Carlson said:
as long as you don't elevate the teachings of the Jewish sages above that of the Scripture, it is to be encouraged to study their teachings. When any teachings of Jewish sages contradict the truth revealed in Scripture, or the truth revealed by the Ruach, we are obligated to reject that teaching.

Shalom.

very true but the Torah teaches us that if we have a struggle with a fellow man that resolves by getting hit by that person then it's "an eye for an eye" yet Yeshua teaches that "when someone strikes you turn the other cheek"

that seems to be pretty much not in line to what Torah teaches but the thing is that Yeshua teached with Authority unlike the rabbis who got their authority from themselves and that's why Yeshua could teach such things ;-)
a fellow believer once told it beautifully "Torah is written to show how a Nation should be run but the teachings of rabbi Yeshua are told to show how a individual should learn to live a life that pleases Him who gave Life"

but hey that's just my opinion, everyone is in titel to his own ofc ! :-)
Yes, I agree with this, because the scriptures say not to add to His word. For the most part, there is nothing the sages teach which truly contradicts the Torah, because their main goal is to interpret the Torah.

Anaiah Priel (Andrew P) Carlson said:
as long as you don't elevate the teachings of the Jewish sages above that of the Scripture, it is to be encouraged to study their teachings. When any teachings of Jewish sages contradict the truth revealed in Scripture, or the truth revealed by the Ruach, we are obligated to reject that teaching.

Shalom.
I don't believe that Y'shua` contradicted the Torah in any way. I don't believe that "an eye for an eye" was ever literal. It has always been interpreted as "if you damage someone's eye, you owe them the value of an eye".
With this understanding, Y'shua` saying to turn the other cheek seems to be more implying that evil is repaid by G-d's justice, so don't worry about what happens to your physical body.

Serkan said:
Anaiah Priel (Andrew P) Carlson said:
as long as you don't elevate the teachings of the Jewish sages above that of the Scripture, it is to be encouraged to study their teachings. When any teachings of Jewish sages contradict the truth revealed in Scripture, or the truth revealed by the Ruach, we are obligated to reject that teaching.

Shalom.

very true but the Torah teaches us that if we have a struggle with a fellow man that resolves by getting hit by that person then it's "an eye for an eye" yet Yeshua teaches that "when someone strikes you turn the other cheek"

that seems to be pretty much not in line to what Torah teaches but the thing is that Yeshua teached with Authority unlike the rabbis who got their authority from themselves and that's why Yeshua could teach such things ;-)
a fellow believer once told it beautifully "Torah is written to show how a Nation should be run but the teachings of rabbi Yeshua are told to show how a individual should learn to live a life that pleases Him who gave Life"

but hey that's just my opinion, everyone is in titel to his own ofc ! :-)
How do you know there's even a "good part" of Sheol?
Eden being in Sheol can be interpreted many ways, f.ex to simply mean it does not exist on earth anymore, it is destroyed by the Flood.

Which Scripture in Luke are you referring to?

Anaiah Priel (Andrew P) Carlson said:
Luke and Enoch both describe such a teaching. It is divided by an impassible chasm. The garden of eden is in Sheol as well, according to the Scriptures.
Okay. BTW I must commend you for your clear debate technique, you're an inspiration.

I refer you to this comprehensive article that I feel answers every position and satisfies my criteria for drawing the conclusion of the Parable not being intended as an exegesis of the afterlife itself.
http://www.herealittletherealittle.net/index.cfm?page_name=Lazarus

Anaiah Priel (Andrew P) Carlson said:
it is often called a parable in Luke, but it is distinct from every other kind of parable. Lazarus and the Rich Man. This is how I understood what Sheol is.

Reply to Discussion

RSS

 

 

 

















 

LINKS

 

 

 

 

Badge

Loading…

© 2019   Created by James Trimm.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Terms of Service