Nazarene Space

Christendom Seeks to Gentilize Yeshua!

Shalom Chaverim,

A major prophetic event that the Scriptures state will occur before the return of Messiah, is just about ready to occur, in fact it is happening right now!

… but in the land of their captivities they shall remember themselves.
And shall know that I am YHWH their Elohim: for I will give them a
heart, and ears to hear: And they shall praise me in the land of their
captivity, and think upon my name, And return from their stiff neck,
and from their wicked deeds: for they shall remember the way of their
fathers, which sinned before YHWH. And I will bring them again into
the land which I promised with an oath unto their fathers, Avraham,
Yitzchak, and Ya'akov, and they shall be masters of it: and I will
increase them, and they shall not be diminished. And I will make an
everlasting covenant with them to be their Elohim, and they shall be
my people: and I will no more drive my people of Israel out of the
land that I have given them.
(Barukh (Baruch) 2:30-35)

This restoration is upon us. Even as the Churches continue to proclaim a "Jesus" that frees them from the "bondage" of the Torah.

Yes the Churches will continue to teach a Torah-less "Jesus" who came to "free you from the bondage of the Law", but truth seekers are learning that the Torah is truth, that the true Messiah, Yeshua, is that Torah truth incarnate and that the Torah is not bondage, but will set you free!

There is no point in asking the Christian preachers and priests about this prophesied restoration of Torah truth as they have rejected what the Scriptures plainly tell us about Torah truth. Modern Christian authorities are hopeless in giving even the basic truths of Scripture.

From a Scriptural perspective Christianity is way off of the mark, it is far removed from truth. By the end of the first Century Gentile Christianity had become a new and different religion, severing its ties with Nazarene Judaism. The Nazarenes, who remained true to Torah were maligned by the “Christians” as “heretics” and “Judaizers” (oh my!—as if to say that which is “Jewish” is evil). This “Christianity” was almost entirely anti-nomian, Hellenistic, pagan and even anti-Semitic.

This new Gentile Christian faith maligned Torah, characterizing it as bondage from which one needs freedom and deliverance, claiming Torah was totally void of any positive spiritual value.

These Christians lost any connection with Hebrew or Hebraic thought. In order to “Gentilize” “Jesus” He had to be stripped of his Jewish language. Even the “New Testament” was “gentilized”, as the Greek translations of its books replaced the original Hebrew and Aramaic. The books were rearranged to give priority to the allegedly “Gentile” epistles of Paul. Greek philosophy and Greek hermeneutics were applied to a Greek New Testament to produce this new anti-nomian, Hellenistic religion. Pagan festivals (Christmas, Easter, Sunday keeping) replaced the biblical Jewish feasts. The Hebraic-Roots of the faith had been totally severed.

Restoring the Scriptures to the world literally and properly translated from their original Hebrew and Aramaic and with the books restored to their original manuscript order, is a major part of this last days restoration.

The Hebraic Roots Version has restored the Scriptures to their original manuscript order, using the original Hebrew and Aramaic (rather than the Greek) and eliminating the anti-nomian mistranslations. But HaSatan will not give up his anti-nomian Greekish New Testament without being dragged kicking and screaming. It is no surprise that an ostensibly Christian organization is now suing us, seeking to effectively ban the HRV Scriptures.

YHWH has called us (you and me and all of the Worldwide Nazarene Assembly of Elohim who are the Remnant) to present the real truths of Scripture to the world. All of us who are members of His Assembly need to be about our Father’s business.

I am honored to be able to be partnered with truth seekers as this restoration of Nazarene Judaism moves forward in fulfillment of prophecy.

It is you who make our work at the WNAE possible. I realize that it is not the activity of James Trimm alone (in my quest to teach Torah and Messiah to a lost world with all the vigor and enthusiasm I can muster) who is responsible to do this work, it is all of us together who are charged with the responsibility of accomplishing this work. I very much look on the efforts of the WNAE as a cooperative one with each one of you. We are all joint heirs with Messiah and should always be about our Father's business in teaching the Torah and the Messiah (and the Messiah is the Word, the Living Torah) to this lost world.

The Hebraic Roots Version has now been in print for eight years (since 2001) and during that time the HRV has become a staple in the Hebraic Roots movement, and the standard English edition Scriptures for much of Nazarene Judaism (the official version of both the WNAE and IANI).

I am constantly hearing from people who tell me how much the HRV has helped them in their understanding of the Word of YHWH. Do not let the Enemy prevail in banning the HRV.

Now more than ever we need your financial support. A special legal defense fund has been created to defend the HRV against this Christian organization. The WNAE is barely receiving enough funds to function, so we are asking the community to increase giving in order to support the WNAE and to help us defend the HRV from this frivolous law suite. HaSatan’s plan here is to financially tie down the WNAE and potentially ban the HRV Scriptures.

If you are not already tithing now is the time to start, the rubber is hitting the road, the battle is heating up, and there is no more time to play around. If you do not feel that you can tithe, then please make whatever offerings you can, as the time is now, the battle is here.

You can make donations to this legal defense fund at http://www.wnae.org or at http://www.nazarenespace.com. You can also make tithes and offerings to the WNAE general fund at the same locations.


Views: 71

Comment by Rudy on August 16, 2009 at 5:46pm
TheDemiprist,

You stated, "Yeshua himself doesn't even follow Torah laws."

Can you give us some examples? What Torah commandments did Yeshua break?

Thanks.
Comment by James Trimm on August 16, 2009 at 6:05pm
Demiprist wrote:
I personally do not want to have the HRV banned, but I also cannot tithe
for a group I happen to disagree with concerning Yeshua as The Messiah.
My honest apologies.


You can always donate directly to the HRV Defense Fund:


Hoevever I would agree with Rudex, where did Yeshua violate Torah? I would be glad to answer such a concern.
Comment by Rudy on August 17, 2009 at 2:14am
Demiprist,

You stated, "I see no evidence that upholds why The Torah incarnate cannot even obey the laws within itself"

It seems to me that one of the reasons you reject Yeshua as Messiah is, not because he didn't obey some of the Torah commandments, but because He didn't obey them the way you believe they ought to be obeyed, right? I mean, when I read these Torah commandments (the ones you pointed out), I honestly dont see how Yeshua broke any of them. Maybe we ought to discuss the proper observance of these commandments before we can discuss wether or not Yeshua kept them.
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 5:11am
Demiprist said:

>He did not marry or procreate. (Gen 1:28)

Actually some claim that he did. I do not agree with them however, because in his role as Creator he had already done so. Obviously If he was who he claimed he was, he would have been a complete soul, not a half soul like you and I, as we seek another half. As the "bridegroom" he was already married to Israel.

>He did not respect Mary and Joseph. (Exod 19:3, 20:12, 21:17, [Deut 5:16])

Not true. There is no example of this. When he called his mother "woman" it was perfectly appropriate in the Hebrew idiom.

>He did not advocate the proper burial of his followers father. (Deut 21:23)

You misunderstand what Yeshua was actually saying here.

>He did not observe/follow Passover. (Exod 12:15,18,19,20, 13:3, Exod 12:8-10)

Well clearly he did, that is what the "Lord's Supper" was.

>He treated neither fellow Jews nor Gentiles with love and respect. (Exod 22:20; Deut 10:19, Lev 19:17-18)

huh?

>He diminished from The Torah itself, concerning Adultery, Dietary, Divorce, and Sabbath, laws.
>(Lev 20:10; Deut 21:10-13, Leviticus 11, Deut 24:1-2, Exod 20:8-11, 16:22-30; Num 15:32-36)

Absolutely not. Site the passage where he did any such thing, and I will show you what is mistranslated or what you are misunderstanding.
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 8:30am
Wow there is so much complete lack of knowledge and understanding in your post. I don't have time to correct ALL of the misinformation right this second, but just one quick example is what you say about the Passover.

Again, pasted from my commentary on Matthew (at http://www.lulu.com/nazarene)

Some have argued that the appearance of artuo here in the Greek NT proves that this was not a Passover Sader. This is simply not true. Artuo is a Greek word with a very broad scope of meaning. Not only can it mean "bread" leavened or unleavened but it can even refer to any kind of food (as in the Greek of Lk. 15:17; 2Thes. 3:8 etc.) so its use does not indicate whether the bread was leavened or unleavened. For proof of this broad use see the word artuo in the GREEK-ENGLISH LEXICON OF THE NEW TESTAMENT AND OTHER EARLY CHRISTIAN LITERATURE by Bauer, Arndt and Gingrich.

Artuo is also the Greek word that is used to translate the Hebrew word lechem in the ancient LXX Greek Tanak (for example in Is. 65:25 where the Hebrew has lechem and the Greek translates artuo).

The Hebrew word lechem (Aramaic: lachma) also has broad meaning and can refer to either leavened or unleavened bread or even any other kind of food (as in Is. 65:25). In fact the traditional blessing for the unleavened bread used at the Passover Sader to this day is:

Baruch ata YHWH, Eloheynu Melech haolam,
hamotzi lechem min haaretz.

Blessed are you YHWH our Elohim, King of the universe
who brings forth bread from the earth.

So even at the Passover sader, the unleavened bread is called lechem (Aramaic lachma and Greek artuo).

The rest of what you say is just as far off. Hopefully I will have time to deal with it soon, but this is enough toi show how your conclusions are lacking in truth.
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 8:35am
As for referring to Gentiles as "dogs" again from my commentary on Matthew at http://www.lulu.com/nazarene

dogs – Gentiles were often likened to dogs because of the fact that they did not seem to care what they eat, while Jews are restrained as to which foods may be eaten or not eaten. Yeshua uses this common imagery of his time to picture gentiles hungry for bits of Torah.
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 8:59am
Again from My commentary on Matthew

5:27-30 You shall not commit adultery – Yeshua built a fence around this commandment (Ex. 20:13 (20:14) & 5:18) saying “whoever sees a woman and covets her has already committed adultery with her in his heart” The Talmud echoes this concept saying::

Unchaste imagination is more injurious than sin itself…
(b.Yoma 29a)

This passage is not condemning men for being sexually attracted to women, but is a commandment against actually coveting another man’s wife.


From my commentary on Yocahnan:

7:53-8:11 Yeshua and the adultress - The story of the adultress (John 7:53-8:11) does not appear in many of the most ancient manuscripts. It does not appear in the Aramaic Peshita or the Aramaic Old Syraic texts. Those Greek manuscripts which do contain it place it in various places some after Luke 21:38 and some after John 7:36 or after 7:52 or even after 21:24. According to the "church father" Papias the story also appeared in the Gospel According to the Hebrews (Papias quoted in Eccl. Hist. iii, 39, 17)

8:6 wrote in the ground – See comments to 8:8

8:7 Whichever one of you is without sin may cast the first stone at her - Yeshua was not contradicting the Torah. The Torah required that the witnesses cast the first stone (Dt. 17:7). According to Qumran Halachah found in the Dead Sea Scrolls:

No one who has knowingly violated a single word of the
commandment will be considered a reliable witness against
his fellow until he considered fit to return to full fellowship.
(Damascus Document 4Q270 frag. 9 col. 10 lines 2-3)

Yeshua seems to have been agreeing with this Halachic precept regarding witnesses.

8:8 writing on the ground

It seems Yeshua was indicating that these men had been an unfaithful bride to YHWH and this is implied by his writing in the dust of the Temple floor of which was used to judge an unfaithful bride (Numbers 5:12-31). He then wrote their names in the dust (Jer. 17:13) indicating that they were unfaithful brides to YHWH and should be judged as well and therefore were not valid witnesses.

Concerning divorce you could see these passages in my Matthew commentary, or you can see the same material with added info here:

http://nazarenespace.ning.com/profiles/blog/show?id=2182335%3ABlogP...

Yeshua’s halacha on divorce was very much Torah based.

Yeshua’a halacah on Sabbath is covered here:
http://nazarenespace.ning.com/group/nazarenehalacha/forum/topics/21...

Again it is perfectly in keeping with Torah.

You seem to lack understanding of the various sects of Judaism that existed in the first century… suffice it to say, the Pharisaic Sanhedrin was not universally accepted in the first century, and no doubt YHWH had more authority than it did. Unless you worship the Pharisaic Sanhardein as a god, then you have no argument.

You need to study and humble yourself as knowing LESS that the Messiah.

I have spent a lifetime studying these things, and I cannot touch Messiah’s knowledge of Torah.
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 9:24am
Comment by James Trimm on August 17, 2009 at 9:58am
Just following each of our arguments to its fullest conclusion.

If I am right then Yeshua is Messiah, and Messiah is the Adam Kadmon, the Middle Pillar of the Godhead, the Son of Yah and definitely had the authority to strip the Pharisaic Sanhedrin of any authority it may have had.

To argue that Yeshua violated Torah by questioning this Sanhedrin's authority, would be akin to arguing that the Pharisaic Sanhedrin had authority equal to or above the Middel Pillar of the Godhead, an authority equal to or greater than YHWH. That would be in effect elevating the Pharisaic Sanhedrin to god-like status.
Comment by Brian Forbes on August 17, 2009 at 12:22pm
Convincing TheDemiprist that Yeshua kept the Torah is like convincing my brother that my sis-in-law is not evil. No matter the facts you come at him with, he will find fault in them. It's clear that he's chosen his position. It's now a heart issue, not a matter of the mind.

I'm not saying that you shouldn't come at him with facts, but they are clearly wasted on him. The facts would be for the sake of the others who have been taken in by his interpretation of scripture.

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