Nazarene Space


At this point it is my intent to send this only to YahSpace Administration.

I will add that there is a feeling starting to circulate that YahSpace has become a heavy handed "cult" banning any who question the hierarchy with no explanation. This recent event certainly IMPLIES that this is true. My original post was aimed at working through that very issue and determining if YahSpace was heading down that path or not...

Response to Sorum:

Well on Monday I posted in an ongoing discussion about the banning of certain individuals. All I said was that I think YahSpace needed to re-examine its banning practices. I said that they needed to decide if it was going to be a private personal social network or Yah's Space, HeKdesh, set apart as Yahweh's.

I said that IF YahSpace is Yah's Space then banning someone is akin to disfellowshipment and should only occur after following a Matthew 18 process.

I agreed that as Overseer Sorum should have the ability to ban someone pending a Matt. 18 process, BUT that there should be an IMMEDIATE explanation.

And for posting this I was banned with no explanation (one was given HOURS later).

AFTER I announced publicly that my account had been frozen with no explanation I was given an explanation the next day.

This "explanation" was to cite the following YahSpace rule:

"Do not disagree with the decisions of Yahspace staff in the public forum, do that in a private email. All decisions to edit, move or delete a post or thread or ban a member are based on the rules listed here and are completely up to YahSpace admins discretion."

"Its not ok for you to say whatever you like on YahSpace and expect the Elders/admins to sit back and take it, if you want to do that, creating a social network of your own might be the best answer for you. Doing so is grounds for immediate Freezing and or Banning of your account."

In short I was banned for even questioning the banning process. One may note that I did not actually violate that rule because my entire post was predicated on an "if" and centered around a SUGGESTION that YahSpace re-examine its practice, not an outright disagreement. In fact Sorum could have replied that YahSpace is NOT HeKdesh and that banning someone is therefore not disfellowshipment and that he need not follow a Matthew 18 process in doing so.

IF YahSpace is HeKdesh (Yah's Space, set apart as Yah's) then one could only be disfellowshipped/banned through a Matthew 18 process. And since a Matthew 18 process can only be carried out regarding one who has "sinned" (Mt. 18:15) and since "sin" is "transgression of the Torah" (1Jn. 3:4) one could only be banned for transgressing the Torah. (clue: nowhere does the Torah say that I cannot publicly disagree with Sorum or his administration)

I will add that calling YahSpace "YahSpace" implies that it is HeKdesh, that it has been vowed to YHWH and is YHWH's property. If not then it would raise the question of usurping the name to vain use (self promotion). If it is a network where disagreeing with Sorum is ground's for disfellowshipment, perhaps it would better be called SorumSpace?

I have also been accused of Lashon HaRa for publicly stating that my YahSpace account was frozen without explanation and recounting the post (calling for a re-examination of banning practices) In fact the post itself was not Lashon HaRa unless you are claiming that freezing my account without explanation was RA (evil). If you are saying that your act of freezing my account was evil, then I will gladly repent of Lashon haRa in this matter. If it is your position that what you did was not RA (evil), then my post was not Lashon HaRa. You cannot claim that you did nothing wrong and call my description of it Lashon HaRa at the same time.

Since banning me for disagreeing with you (or actually for my suggesting that you re-examine your policies) was weak you seem to feel a need to add reasons. In this you objected to the fact that YahSpace members had gotten invites from me to NazareneSpace. The fact is that your problem here is not with me, your problem is with ning. YahSpace is a ning network, when someone on YahSpace asks to join my friends list and I accept then they become my friend on ning in general. If I later "share" a blog on another ning group (like NazareneSpace) or send invites to join another ning group

(like NazareneSpace) to my "friends" then these people will get invites to NazareneSpace... thats not my fault, it is unreasonable to expect YahSpace members to never use the "share" or "invite" features with their "friends" on any other ning group (especially there own) out of concern that their friends that happen to be YahSpace members will get the invitation. Again your objection is with the way ning networks function, not with me.

In a second email you accused me of soliciting funds on YahSpace. I have not done so in MONTHS. The only way I did do so MONTHS ago was in adding a short statement on the bottom of my blogs "If you would like to support this work..." but after being reproved for this by YahSpace months ago I began posting my blogs on YahSpace with this footer REMOVED. This is simply a false charge.


It is disappointing that after several hours, there has been ZERO response to this from ANY of the several YahSpace administrators. You refuse to deal with things in private and then complain if they are dealt with in public. You cannot have it both ways.

Views: 836

Comment by James Trimm on May 13, 2009 at 12:11pm
I think by now most people already know what happened with our own attempt tp publish the HRV Bible several years ago. You are right, this is very much an after the fact smear campaign. I can post the emails from YahSpace which plainly state that I was banned for, it had nothing to do with the HRV.

As most of you know several years ago we attempted to self publish the HRV Bible. The attempt turned into a financial disaster for us. The printer delivered months late, never provided the number of copies we actually paid for, and the copies we did receive had a very high defective rate (like 33%!). Those who donated (and the word was "donated") to help make the printing possible were supposed to receive a copy as an appreciation gift, but in the end there were not enough copies to go around. On top of all f this, at about this time our house was flooded. We contacted a lawyer about suing, but were told that since one of the parties of the suite was in India it would be exorbitantly expensive to do so. We publicly repented of the fact that we were going to be unable to provide a copy to everyone who donated and asked the community for forgiveness in the matter.

ISR then picked up publication of the HRV Scriptures and a deal was worked out to provide copies from their printing to those who had donated and not received their copy (or copies). We made an offer to all who were due a copy and a copy was offered to them from the ISR printing (a portion of my royalties was deducted to help finance these copies). Even then some refused to accept these copies insisting that *I* owed them a copy not ISR, there were others that just said they no longer wanted a copy. In the end we did the best we could. This was about five years ago, due to a hard drive crash we no longer have records of who was due a copy, but I can say that a fair effort was made to get everyone who was due a copy, a copy.
Comment by stephen on May 13, 2009 at 11:21pm
I am sorry I have to comment on this. I usually try to stay away from topics like this but this time I must say some things.

First off let me predicate this by saying I have known James longer than almost anybody on this board. In fact I have known him even longer than his wife by a few years. James is a friend, a decent person, and perhaps the best living messianic scholar. He is also human. We all make mistakes and have faults. My friend James, perhaps in his zeal to publish one of the most important works of his life , bit off a little more than he could chew. To make good on this, because he is not a crook nor a fraud, he traded a good share of the proceeds from a work he spent YEARS on to insure that the current HRV publisher would square anybody who donated to his project. From all accounts the company has kept the bargain to the nest of anybodies ability.

Anyone who says that James did not supply them with and HRV and some other company did is being petty. I mean did they expect a copy that was handwritten on paper made by James from trees he grew? He wrote the notes, did the research, compiled the effort over years of unpaid labor. He found a company that would, do to a financial arrangement that is really not anybodies concern, manufacture and ship the HRV and they did. What else matters? That he did way more than he was legally obligated to? That he cares enough about this movement and helping people find a way out of sin and the lies of the "Church" system to work for years for no salary, invest a large sum of his own money, take huge hits from unreliable printers and make good in the end? I do not get it. I have met crooks, they look and act nothing like my friend.
Comment by James Trimm on May 14, 2009 at 1:33pm
For the record I have received a message from Sorum which said in part:

"I know you have heard about the blogs that had posted on YahSpace about you. I will let you know that the second I saw them I deleted them and sent them a warning,..."

Although this message was sent privately, I have no doubt Sorum would not object to my posting this short passage here.
Comment by albert f green on February 23, 2011 at 11:34pm
hey james-yahspace has closed down. do you or anyone on n.s. know what happened? my personal opinion is they did not have a lot of activity or interest from what i saw in responses to posts and articles. do you know anything about what happened?
Comment by James Trimm on February 24, 2011 at 12:36am
Not a clue.
Comment by James Trimm on February 26, 2011 at 12:28am
Popular Messianic Social Network YahSpace Shuts Down for Good


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