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The lost tribes?? Or always there tribes??

I have read alot about the whole "lost tribes" mystery and even scientists have tried to show that irish or african or other races are the actual Bet Yisrael yet ... does the Scripture actually say that there were at any point in Jewish history ever any tribes "lost" at all??

I mean if the tribes did not return after Babylon then how come Yeshua gave his Malkutha-offer to all the Jews living in Yisrael?? I mean if the "lost tribes" theory is true then Yeshua was only offering Malkutha to Bet Yehuda?? And why does the Prophet Ezechiel actually make claims that during his lifetime all the tribes of Yisrael were well know and knew very well about themselves that they were Bet Yisrael and that some of them who were not completely lost in idolatery actually went up to the Pelgrim Moedim ?? And if Bet Yisrael really is "lost" how come Luqa (luke) bluntly claims that during Yeshua his presentation at the temple as an infant there was a woman there of the tribe of Asher, how is that possible if the tribe was lost of Asher?

Please i urge you all to read this study it will make everything quite clear! ;)
http://www.lightofmashiach.org/losttribes.html

shalom akhim

much more logical questions can be made

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What became of these “Lost Ten Tribes”? The apocryphal book of 4th Ezra (2Esdras) tells us that they went to a region known as “Artzaret”, but this is of little help in actually locating them, because this is simply a contraction of the Hebrew phrase meaning “another land”:

39: And whereas you saw that he gathered another peaceable multitude unto him;
40: Those are the ten tribes, which were carried away prisoners out of their own land in the time of Hoshea the king, whom Shal’man’eser the king of Assyria led away captive, and he carried them over the waters, and so came they into another land.
41: But they took this counsel among themselves, that they would leave the multitude of the heathen, and go forth into a further country, where never mankind dwelt,
42: That they might there keep their statutes, which they never kept in their own land.
43: And they entered into Euphrates by the narrow places of the river.
44: For Elyon then showed signs for them, and held still the flood, till they were passed over.
45: For through that country there was a great way to go, namely, of a year and a half: and the same region is called Artzaret .
(2nd Ezra 11:39-46 (13:39-46) HRV)

The first century Jewish writer Josephus seems to have known something of them, he says only that they were “beyond the Euphrates” and had a large population in his day:

…the ten tribes are beyond the Euphrates until
now, and are an immense multitude, and not to
be estimated by numbers.
(Josephus; Ant. 11:5:2)

According to the Midrash Rabbah the Lost Ten Tribes migrated beyond a river known as the "Sabatyon"

The ten tribes were exiled to within the region
of the river Sabatyon…
(Midrash Rabba, Sh'lach 16).

The identity of this river has remained a mystery. The primary clue to the identity of the mysterious Sabatyon river is also found in Midrash Rabbah which quotes Rabbi Akiba as saying:

...the river Sabatyon carries stones the whole
week but allows them to rest on the Sabbath.
(Genesis Rabbah 11:5)

Similarly the Talmud says:

Let the river Sabatyon prove that the
Seventh day is the Sabbath.
(b.Sanh. 65b)

The prophet Ovadyah (Obadiah) speaks of the destination of the House of Israel as follows:

And the captivity of this host of the children of Yisrael,
that are among the Kena’anites, even unto Tzarfat, and
the captivity of Yerushalayim, that is in Sepharad, shall
possess the cities of the South.
(Ovadyah 1:20)

Where is Tzarfat? Tzarfat is the Hebrew word for “France”. In fact, if you were reading a newspaper in Israel today, and it referred to France, the word used would be “Tzarfat”.

Rashi’s commentary to Ob. 1:20 says: "Tzarfat is the kingdom of France.”

Recently research has been conducted by Orthodox Jewish Israeli scholars which traces the migrations of these Lost Ten Tribes. Two of these scholars are John Hulley (Yochanan ben David) and Yair Davidy.

John Hulley recently published a paper in the Israeli journal B'Or Ha'Torah (In the light of Torah) in which he traced the migrations of these "Lost Tribes" north west, across the Bosphorus straits between the Mediterranean and the Black sea.

Yair Davidy has written three books under the Rabbinic approbation of Orthodox Israeli Rabbi Abraham Feld. These are The Tribes; Ephraim and Lost Israelite Identity. Yair Davidy's thoroughly documented research has shown that the Lost Ten Tribes, which
had been transplanted to the outskirts of Assyria came to be known as the Sakeans (they were previously known as Yitzakheans or in Aramaic Isakeans). These Sakeans are known to have migrated northwest and made their way into Europe to become the Scythians (S'kitheans) and Saxons (Saksons). Davidy's research has shown that other tribal groups of the Lost Ten Tribes also emerged in Europe under names similar to those of the Tribe of Israel, such as: Galics (Galileans); Danes (Dans); Cimereans (Simeons); Goths/Gots (Gads "Gad" is pronounced in Hebrew as "God").

Dr. James Tabor of the Universtity of North Carolina has said:

Based on this and much additional research it can
be definitely be shown that significant portions of
the Lost Tribes migrated northwest, toward Europe
and are to be found today among the Anglo-Saxon-Celtic
and associated peoples. In other words the tribes are
largely located today in the United States, Great Britain,
northwestern Europe, Australia, New Zealand and
other scattered areas. They are primarily Protestant...
(Restoring Abrahamic Faith; James Tabor; page 46)

Dr. Tabor has also said:

This is not the so-called "Anglo-Israel" theory of many
of the racist groups. This is hard-core historical
research as to where these tribes actually migrated.
(Remarks on the Return of the Lost Tribes; James Tabor)

As these Ephraimites migrated northwest into Euprope they brought their pagan gods and goddesses with them. Thus the Babylonian goddess Ishtar became the Anglo-Saxon goddess Eostre and Ba'al Gad became "God" . They worshiped these pagan gods in temples they called "KIRKS" .
If they did migrate to other parts of the world and if it was indeed so that during the time of Yeshua only Bet Yehudah was there then how come Yeshua offered Malkutha only to Bet Yehudah while he himself said "i have come solely for the lost sheep of Yisrael" Yisrael not meaning Bet Yehudah alone but Bet Yisrael as well!!

Even Sha'ul, who wrote so much about the "Israel of G-d" and insisted that Gentiles have their own place in G-d's kingdom, even he NEVER once made a stance that Gentiles EVER became natural Israel. Instead, he contrasted Gentiles to Israelites. We can be thankful we have a merciful G-d Who allows His people Israel AND others who aren't Israelite to join His covenant.

Why do you suppose, in all the pages of the Brit Chadasha, there is no mention of finding the "ten lost tribes?" Given the prophecies involving both houses, it would seem that if there are lost tribes, then someone, somewhere, would have made some mention of them. If the Gentiles were true lost Israelites coming home, then wouldn't their 'return' would have been heralded? Wouldn't it have been like a "kill the fatted calf -- the prodigal ones have returned" celebration? How could the Brit Chadasha neglect to mention the "lost tribes" if they truly were lost? How could the Brit Chadasha writers fail to mention that the Gentiles coming into the faith were really the lost tribes? Wouldn't it have been worthy of mention? Clearly, the Brit Chadasha writers viewed Israel as already united with Judah. There were no lost tribes and the unification of the houses was no longer an issue.

"Although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless." Philippians 3:4-6
If Israel hadn't been reunified, then shouldn't Sha'ul have said he was a Yehudi (Judahite - from the House of Judah) instead?
We know Benjaminites and Levites are counted as Judah, but so are other tribes. We've seen that lots of Brit Chadasha passages show Israel is synonymous with the Jewish people, now we see an Asherite mentioned:
"And there was a prophetess, Anna the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Asher." Luke 2:36
Nothing in this passage indicates that being an Asherite was unusual. But had there really been lost tribes, this passage would have drawn special attention to Asher and commented how her presence was possible -- wouldn't she be the 'last of her kind' if there were lost tribes? But notice instead it is mentioned simply and matter-of-factly, as if nothing is unusual about the presence of a supposed 'lost tribe' member. No wonder, since no tribes were missing!
Serkan,

To explain those passages, I have read that before Israel was captured by the Assyrians, many Israelites fled to the kingdom of Judah. That would explain why there are mentions of benjamintes & Ashurites in the NT.


Serkan said:
If they did migrate to other parts of the world and if it was indeed so that during the time of Yeshua only Bet Yehudah was there then how come Yeshua offered Malkutha only to Bet Yehudah while he himself said "i have come solely for the lost sheep of Yisrael" Yisrael not meaning Bet Yehudah alone but Bet Yisrael as well!!

Even Sha'ul, who wrote so much about the "Israel of G-d" and insisted that Gentiles have their own place in G-d's kingdom, even he NEVER once made a stance that Gentiles EVER became natural Israel. Instead, he contrasted Gentiles to Israelites. We can be thankful we have a merciful G-d Who allows His people Israel AND others who aren't Israelite to join His covenant.

Why do you suppose, in all the pages of the Brit Chadasha, there is no mention of finding the "ten lost tribes?" Given the prophecies involving both houses, it would seem that if there are lost tribes, then someone, somewhere, would have made some mention of them. If the Gentiles were true lost Israelites coming home, then wouldn't their 'return' would have been heralded? Wouldn't it have been like a "kill the fatted calf -- the prodigal ones have returned" celebration? How could the Brit Chadasha neglect to mention the "lost tribes" if they truly were lost? How could the Brit Chadasha writers fail to mention that the Gentiles coming into the faith were really the lost tribes? Wouldn't it have been worthy of mention? Clearly, the Brit Chadasha writers viewed Israel as already united with Judah. There were no lost tribes and the unification of the houses was no longer an issue.

"Although I myself might have confidence even in the flesh. If anyone else has a mind to put confidence in the flesh, I far more: circumcised the eighth day, of the nation of Israel, of the tribe of Benjamin, a Hebrew of Hebrews; as to the Law, a Pharisee; as to zeal, a persecutor of the church; as to the righteousness which is in the Law, found blameless." Philippians 3:4-6
If Israel hadn't been reunified, then shouldn't Sha'ul have said he was a Yehudi (Judahite - from the House of Judah) instead?
We know Benjaminites and Levites are counted as Judah, but so are other tribes. We've seen that lots of Brit Chadasha passages show Israel is synonymous with the Jewish people, now we see an Asherite mentioned:
"And there was a prophetess, Anna the daughter of Phanuel, of the tribe of Asher." Luke 2:36
Nothing in this passage indicates that being an Asherite was unusual. But had there really been lost tribes, this passage would have drawn special attention to Asher and commented how her presence was possible -- wouldn't she be the 'last of her kind' if there were lost tribes? But notice instead it is mentioned simply and matter-of-factly, as if nothing is unusual about the presence of a supposed 'lost tribe' member. No wonder, since no tribes were missing!
James Pierce said:
Serkan,

To explain those passages, I have read that before Israel was captured by the Assyrians, many Israelites fled to the kingdom of Judah. That would explain why there are mentions of benjamintes & Ashurites in the NT.


Serkan said:
!

aha and again like in my post i just did on Tefillin, where is your evidence?? I have scriptural evidence that the Tribes were never ever lost and the Propthets even claim in their writings in the Tanach that certain people from Bet Yisrael actually went back to Yisrael for the yearly festivals ;) no the Scripture clearly proves that the tribes were never lost and again if they were then Yeshua was not the Messiah because he did not offer Malkutha to ALL of Yisrael but only to Bet Yehudah ;)
Serkan,

What is Malkutha, and show me evidence in scripture where Israel was never taken captive by Assyria, and they never returned????

Serkan said:
James Pierce said:
Serkan,

To explain those passages, I have read that before Israel was captured by the Assyrians, many Israelites fled to the kingdom of Judah. That would explain why there are mentions of benjamintes & Ashurites in the NT.


Serkan said:
!

aha and again like in my post i just did on Tefillin, where is your evidence?? I have scriptural evidence that the Tribes were never ever lost and the Propthets even claim in their writings in the Tanach that certain people from Bet Yisrael actually went back to Yisrael for the yearly festivals ;) no the Scripture clearly proves that the tribes were never lost and again if they were then Yeshua was not the Messiah because he did not offer Malkutha to ALL of Yisrael but only to Bet Yehudah ;)
Actually the House of Judah was made up of Judah, Benjamin and Levi.

The lost Ten tribes were the other ten tribes (counting Manasseh and Ephraim separately).

One Asherite does not make a House of Israel.

I used to hold to the view that the Jewish people make up all of the 12 tribes. But the fact is that the Tanak is filled with prophecies about the reunion of the two houses of Israel. The context of these prophecies is always in the last days. So if a House of Israel (Ephraim) is to be joined to the House of Judah in the last days, then the House of Israel ("Lost Ten Tribes") have to have existed as a separate group of people until that reunion.

You may notice that Zechariah who writes AFTER the Jewish return to the Land under Ezra prophecies of the true return of Israel out of "the North" as a future event.
James Pierce said:
Serkan,

What is Malkutha, and show me evidence in scripture where Israel was never taken captive by Assyria, and they never returned????

Serkan said:
James Pierce said:
Serkan,

To explain those passages, I have read that before Israel was captured by the Assyrians, many Israelites fled to the kingdom of Judah. That would explain why there are mentions of benjamintes & Ashurites in the NT.


Serkan said:
!


dude this is the second time allready that you completely misqoute me and say something i never posted ...

pls read again what i said oy vey ...
the fact that you don't know what Malkutha is and stands for shows me you are not yet fully grown in the faith yet you allready then condemn ancient Jewish practices like Tefillin which i seriously don't get..
how long have you been in church and have you only recently come out of it? (that's no insult but a serious question so i know who i am dealing with here..)
Trimm,

When all 12 tribes return, then what will happen?? When and how will they return to agree to the new covenant?

James Trimm said:
Actually the House of Judah was made up of Judah, Benjamin and Levi.

The lost Ten tribes were the other ten tribes (counting Manasseh and Ephraim separately).

One Asherite does not make a House of Israel.

I used to hold to the view that the Jewish people make up all of the 12 tribes. But the fact is that the Tanak is filled with prophecies about the reunion of the two houses of Israel. The context of these prophecies is always in the last days. So if a House of Israel (Ephraim) is to be joined to the House of Judah in the last days, then the House of Israel ("Lost Ten Tribes") have to have existed as a separate group of people until that reunion.

You may notice that Zechariah who writes AFTER the Jewish return to the Land under Ezra prophecies of the true return of Israel out of "the North" as a future event.
James Pierce said:
Trimm,

When all 12 tribes return, then what will happen?? When and how will they return to agree to the new covenant?

James Trimm said:
Actually the House of Judah was made up of Judah, Benjamin and Levi.

The lost Ten tribes were the other ten tribes (counting Manasseh and Ephraim separately).

One Asherite does not make a House of Israel.

I used to hold to the view that the Jewish people make up all of the 12 tribes. But the fact is that the Tanak is filled with prophecies about the reunion of the two houses of Israel. The context of these prophecies is always in the last days. So if a House of Israel (Ephraim) is to be joined to the House of Judah in the last days, then the House of Israel ("Lost Ten Tribes") have to have existed as a separate group of people until that reunion.

You may notice that Zechariah who writes AFTER the Jewish return to the Land under Ezra prophecies of the true return of Israel out of "the North" as a future event.

dude ... it's the 10 tribes who have to return and not twelve because Bet Yehudah is made up of the Jews and Cohenim..
Serkan,

Explain to me when did ALL of Israel return from Assyrian captivity?

Serkan said:
James Pierce said:
Trimm,

When all 12 tribes return, then what will happen?? When and how will they return to agree to the new covenant?

James Trimm said:
Actually the House of Judah was made up of Judah, Benjamin and Levi.

The lost Ten tribes were the other ten tribes (counting Manasseh and Ephraim separately).

One Asherite does not make a House of Israel.

I used to hold to the view that the Jewish people make up all of the 12 tribes. But the fact is that the Tanak is filled with prophecies about the reunion of the two houses of Israel. The context of these prophecies is always in the last days. So if a House of Israel (Ephraim) is to be joined to the House of Judah in the last days, then the House of Israel ("Lost Ten Tribes") have to have existed as a separate group of people until that reunion.

You may notice that Zechariah who writes AFTER the Jewish return to the Land under Ezra prophecies of the true return of Israel out of "the North" as a future event.

dude ... it's the 10 tribes who have to return and not twelve because Bet Yehudah is made up of the Jews and Cohenim..
Shalom Serkan. Those are great questions with suprisingly simple answers in my opinion. This is such an important topic to me. The reunification of the two house of Israel could be the most important event in human history, and important events take thousands of years to complete. I doubt there is any topic more important than understanding two house other than Torah observance.

It appears that your main concern is seeing the two house process within the NT.

"Why do you suppose, in all the pages of the Brit Chadasha, there is no mention of finding the "ten lost tribes?" Given the prophecies involving both houses, it would seem that if there are lost tribes, then someone, somewhere, would have made some mention of them...Wouldn't it have been like a "kill the fatted calf -- the prodigal ones have returned" celebration? How could the Brit Chadasha neglect to mention the "lost tribes" if they truly were lost? How could the Brit Chadasha writers fail to mention that the Gentiles coming into the faith were really the lost tribes? Wouldn't it have been worthy of mention?"

So I think we can break down your concerns into

1 - There is no mention of "finding" what is "lost" in the NT.

2 - Wouldnt the authors of the NT celebrated if the tribes were returning?

3 - How come the NT doesnt tell us the gentiles are lost israelites?

Those are great questions, lets see if we can get some answers for them.

First some condensed history. Most of the prophets in the Tanak spends lots of time speaking about the nation of Israel splitting into two different nations or people groups. Then the prophets go on to tell us that one day these two seperate nations would be scattered into every nation on every inch of the earth. The concept of being scattered to the four corners of the earth is big in the Tanak. Hashem promised clear back in the Torah that the entire earth would be filled up to over flowing with Israelite descendants. The northern kingdom of Israel was the main vehicle by Hashem fulfilled that promise. 2800 years ago the northern kingdom of Israel was taken by huge numbers into captivity and "scattered to the four corners of the earth". Now the task is rounding these guys and gals back up.

Concern 1 - there is no mention of lost and found in the NT.

Answer - actually there is a lot mention of lost and found in the NT.

Matt 10:6 "But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." - Yeshua STARTS a mission to find the lost 10 tribes.

Matt 15:24 "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel." Yeshua confirms that his mission is exclusively to find the lost sheep of the northern kingdom.

Matt 18:11 "For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. "

Luke 15:14 "What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it?" Yeshua confirms that he has STARTED a mission to find, to go after that which is lost the northern kingdom.

Luke 19:10 "For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost."

Yeshua states very often that he came to find the lost ten tribes of the northern kingdom of Israel.

Concern 2 - Wouldnt the authors of the NT celebrated if the tribes were returning?

Short answer - They will at the end days, when the process is complete. The following examples are all taken from one long discussion of lost - found - celebration by Yeshua in Luke chapter 15.

What man of you, having an hundred sheep, if he lose one of them, doth not leave the ninety and nine in the wilderness, and go after that which is lost, until he find it? And when he hath found [it], he layeth [it] on his shoulders, rejoicing. And when he cometh home, he calleth together [his] friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.

In this parable Yeshua confirms that there will an AMAZING celebration AFTER the complete return of the northern kingdom of Israel. NOT at the very beginning of the process. Yeshua 2000 years ago only started the process, it was not time to fully rejoice in his day. There was still alot of work to do and still is, its not party time yet.

Either what woman having ten pieces of silver, if she lose one piece, doth not light a candle, and sweep the house, and seek diligently till she find [it]? And when she hath found [it], she calleth [her] friends and [her] neighbours together, saying, Rejoice with me; for I have found the piece which I had lost.

Yeshua give the greatest parable on the lost - found - celebration scenario of the northern kingdom in the story of the prodigal son. My comments are in ( )

And he said, A certain man had two sons (Northern and Southern kingdom): And the younger of them (Northern kingdom) said to [his] father, Father, give me the portion of goods that falleth [to me]. And he divided (The kindom of Isreal is divided into 2 kingdoms) unto them [his] living. And not many days after the younger son gathered all together, and took his journey into a far (The Tanak states many times that the northern kingdom woud be cast FAR OFF or FAR AWAY. They became the people known as "you who are far off") country, and there wasted his substance with riotous living (northern kingdom was particularly rebelious against the Torah). And when he had spent all, there arose a mighty famine in that land (lack of Torah); and he began to be in want. And he went and joined himself to a citizen of that country (It is important to note that the northern kingdom JOINED WITH OR GRAFTED INTO OR BECAME GENTILES. This is confirmed in the prophet Hoshea who stated that the northern kingdom became "Lo Ami" NOT MY PEOPLE.); and he sent him into his fields to feed swine. And he would fain have filled his belly with the husks that the swine did eat (Northern kingdom became unclean animals they DESCENDED to the state of UNCLEAN and therefore need to be ELEVATED back to the state of clean, thus the vision of the UNCLEAN animals DESCENDING on a talit and being RAISED back up): and no man gave unto him. And when he came to himself, he said, How many hired servants of my father's have bread enough and to spare, and I perish with hunger! I will arise (Rise from the dead - the northern kingdom is dead in tresspasses and sin) and go to my father (repent turn to Torah), and will say unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and before thee, And am no more worthy to be called thy son: make me as one of thy hired servants. And he arose, and came to his father. But when he was yet a great way off, his father saw him, and had compassion,(In Hoshea chapter 1 Hashem calls the northern kingdom LO AMI - NOT MY PEOPLE and LO RUCHAMAH - NO LONGER UNDER MY COMPASSION or grace) and ran, and fell on his neck, and kissed him. And the son said unto him, Father, I have sinned against heaven, and in thy sight, and am no more worthy to be called thy son. But the father said to his servants, Bring forth the best robe, and put [it] on him; and put a ring on his hand, and shoes on [his] feet (This is to further show the conection to the northern kingdom JOSEPH the same thing happened to JOSEPH WHEN HE CAME OUT OF PRISON): And bring hither the fatted calf, and kill [it]; and let us eat, and be merry: For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found (DEAD IS = TO LOST - ALIVE IS = TO FOUND). And they began to be merry (ONLY after the complete return of all the northern kingdom will the fulness of the celebration begin). Now his elder son was in the field: and as he came and drew nigh to the house, he heard musick and dancing. And he called one of the servants, and asked what these things meant. And he said unto him, Thy brother is come; and thy father hath killed the fatted calf, because he hath received him safe and sound. And he was angry, and would not go in: therefore came his father out, and intreated him. And he answering said to [his] father, Lo, these many years do I serve thee, neither transgressed I at any time thy commandment: and yet thou never gavest me a kid, that I might make merry with my friends: But as soon as this thy son was come, which hath devoured thy living with harlots, thou hast killed for him the fatted calf. And he said unto him, Son, thou art ever with me, and all that I have is thine. It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.

My own parable of why we dont see a full celebration of the return of the lost tribes in the gospels. Imagine a dump truck full of sand. This sand is a very precious sand and each grain is worth a fortune. Imagine someone presses the wrong button and drops all the sand as the truck is driving down the highway. The workers pull over and look at the mess. They walk to there storage box on the truck and pull out there shovels and begin to cheer "Yea we have done it our work is done we got our shovels!" Would that make sense? Of course not. They have a HUGE task ahead of them. Not only do they have to shovel the big bulks of sand, but they have to go over the whole area with a fine tooth comb finding every last speck of their sand. Its A LONG TEDIOUS PROCESS. BUT AFTER THEY FIND THE LAST SPECK THEY CAN REJOICE THE WORK IS DONE!

Concern 3 - How come the NT doesnt tell us the gentiles are lost israelites? It does if you know the idioms.

If I were to say to you "Hey have you heard that the king of pop is dead?" You would probably know that I am talking about Michael Jackson. But what if you knew nothing of American pop culture? You would have no idea who the "king of pop" is. So too with the NT refering to the northern kingdom. The northern kingdom has lots of idiomatic names.

1 - The lost

2 - The dead

3 - Far off

4 - Among the gentiles (This is an important and often used term for northern kingdom in the prophets)

5 - Uncircumcised

6 - Joseph

7 - Ephraim

...And more.

We can take Acts 15 as one example.

Acts 15:14 "Simon has declared how Elohim first visited the gentiles to take out of them a people for his name. And the word of the prophets agree with this, as it has been written: After this I shall return and rebuild the tabernacle of David which has fallen down. And I shall rebuild its ruins, and I shall set it up, so that the remnant of mankind shall seek Hashem even all the gentiles on whom my name is called...Therefore I judge we should not trouble those from among the gentiles who are turning to Elohim..."

Now with our Tanak eyes on this passage is not about taking Gentiles in place of Israel, but TAKING ISRAELITES OUT OF THE GENTILES.

The passage does not say he visited to the gentiles to take gentiles, it says he visit gentiles to take out of the gentiles. What is "in the gentiles" that needed to come out? The northern kingdom of Israel had been cast INTO all nations/gentiles.

The passage then goes on to speak about the REBUILDING of the tabernacle of David, THE TWELVE TRIBES OF ISRAEL. We are talking about the REBUILDING of the Israelite nation not the replacement there of with gentiles.

"we should not trouble those from AMONG THE GENTILES who are turning." THIS IS EXACTLY the story of the prodigal son. The older brother (Judah) wanted to trouble the younger brother (Joseph - northern kingdom) who is trying to repent.

Those from among the gentiles is the northern kingdom. They were cast off to live far off among the gentiles. All gentiles who have an inner desire to return to the Torah because of the words of Yeshua are lost Israelite souls desiring to repent. Thus Yeshua says "my sheep hear my voice"

To test this theory try reading Ephesians and see if it works. Ephesians speaks about

You who were dead (prodigal son)

Among whom (among the gentiles)

Made us alive (alive again prodigal son)

You once gentiles in the flesh (northern kingdom was declared lo ami in hosea chapter one, they became uncircumcised gentiles)

With out Messiah (lost sheep with out shepherd)

excluded from citizenship (10 northern tribes were cut out of the covenant)

now in Messiah you who were FAR OFF have been brought near. (Northern kingdom was cast far off)

who has made both one (Judah and Ephraim are only reunited by the work of Mashiach.)
ok shawn thanks that sounds quite good yet my problem is also that if the tribes were truly "lost" and thereby "outside of Yisrael" then how come Yeshua never went outside of Yisrael's boundries to preach his message to the "lost tribes" he came for?? So that would lead me to believe they were never outside yet inside of Yisrael when Yeshua was there..

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